Interview with Harvee Pene on Purpose | ProActive Podcast #117
This inspiring episode of the ProActive podcast features author, TEDx speaker, and accountant Harvee Pene. Listen as we explore the who, what, and why of motivation, finding inspiration when times seem their darkest, and the importance of goal setting.
This one is perfect for anyone in need of a little motivation and to find out what building a brand on purpose meant for Harvee Pene.
Chris Hogan - Thank you so much, Harvee, for joining me, mate. I've been following your journey since joining KPI programme, last year. It's the first time I was introduced to you. And, your story about Inspire Accountants is inspirational, to say the least. Doing business for good is, I guess, how you changed your business for the better. Both financially and both with your impact on the globe. Thanks so much for joining me, man.
Harvee Pene - Pleasure, so good and thanks for the kind words, bro, anything I can do to help inspire others.
Chris Hogan - Awesome. So one of the things that you've done recently is that you posted publicly on Facebook on May 7th, an announcement that you're leaving Inspire. And actually you said you're leaving Inspire in, mostly good hands, of course no better hands than yours right? And you're living in a better place. And you're off to discover new oceans. You've spent the last five years transforming Inspire from a cash building good idea, to an seven figure impact machine, recognising twice as, sorry recognised as twice, one of the top 100 companies in Australia. Mate, can you just reflect back to that moment when it was a cash fleeing business? Because I'm sure there's plenty of people out there that can identify with that. What was your pain then? What was the real pain?
Harvee Pene - Well the context was, when I bought into Inspire is, it was a good idea. So, there's 10,000 accounting firms around Australia, and so when you want to start a new accounting firm in a really crowded market, I think you need to find ways to sort of differentiate yourself. And so my business partner at the time, Ben, got some advice or an idea from somebody, and said, hey, you know what? You should not just have an accounting firm, you should have a cafe. You should open the cafe, let that be the centre of the office and you have your accounting firm around that but you're building it, an environment, a network, a community around that concept, and bless the soul of my business partner who's that type of guy who says, yeah, let's just do it, he loves implementing it and many ideas. So we literally launched Inspire Cafe and it was a cafe in Newstead, in Brisbane, that sold coffees and stuff and had people and customers and then we literally had an accounting firm on top. And what was crazy is that, it was such a cool idea that we got a lot of traction, 'cause the media was like oh my gosh, what an accounting firm that sort of can serve you a coffee in the middle of it? And we got lots of media and we got put on the map. The challenge was, it just didn't make financial sense and maybe all of us listening in today, we've all been struck by an entrepreneurial seizure where we thought, you know what, I think I've got a good idea for something. And in our case it was the cafe. And, we went and had a crack at it, but it just didn't make financial sense, it was too far from our core business of what we were here on this planet to do and so it never made any money. In retrospect, it was a really expensive way to get cut through and media and get the attention. So it did it's job, we got put on the map, but in a very expensive way. So one super quick example, we had a lease. Many people listening in all commit to commercial lease, et cetera. You might fall over at the sight or the sound of this, Chris, but we were paying 11 and a half thousand dollars plus GST per month, for the month for the lease and we're committed to a seven year lease or something like that. It was just, It was just crazy.
Chris Hogan - Dived right in there mate.
Harvee Pene - Oh, totally in. And so, why I wanna mention that is, that yes, we run the accounting firm and we are now authors of the book "Cashed Up" and you'd expect like, as numbers people, we'd be masters of all these things. But I think we've got to remember that at our core role's, still human beings. And whether numbers people are not, at our basis, we're humans and humans get excited by ideas and humans commit to things that are emotionally driven rather than financially driven. And the lesson that we learned is that we needed to have some external help, some external perspective and feedback to make sure these aren't just good ideas, but that they're smart financial decisions at the same time. So we had to eat our own medicine and undo some of those financial decisions. And yet no one's perfect, but that's what makes us stronger. That's what makes us more motivated to make smarter financial decisions and maybe the final pieces the whole purpose of starting Inspire Cafe wasn't to serve coffees, is it was to be different. It was to stand out in a crowded market. And it was to take a position where we're here we're on this planet, but we're on this planet to do a very different thing to what every other accounting firm has ever come before us has ever done. And so I think it was perhaps the right intention, but the wrong execution, but it's that writing, that intention that has taken us through to where we are today and we finally got it right. As top 100 companies in Australia and I believe firmly on a mission to become Australia's most impactful accounting firm.
Chris Hogan - Unbelievable, unbelievable. So, that's a good segue into basically what happened next and that you wanted to, better align yourself with the UN global sustainability goals, otherwise known as SDGs. Tell us about that, it was something along the lines of a dollar for a dollar given issue.
Harvee Pene - Yeah, that's right so we became really well known for giving initiative called, Day for Dollar. Where for every dollar of tax that we practically saved our small business clients, we gave a day of access to food, water, health and sanitation to families in need. And so, at the time of my retirement, sounds crazy to say at 34 years old, but at the time of my retirement the beginning of 2020, we reached, I'm really proud to say we reached $10 million in proactive tax savings for our small business clients. Which they use to reinvest back into growing their business and growing their families and that's just, that's beautiful. That's really the difference we set out to make in the beginning. We didn't need to set out to make coffees, we needed to make an impact. And so, that was our first layer of impact but thanks to our Day for Dollar initiative, it means that we've also given over 10 million days of life changing help to families in need in over 16 countries as of today. And so, that's a pretty humbling statement. I love reflecting on that level of impact. And what it meant for us is it gave us the privilege to be able to say that we're making an impact to the person that was or the family that was sitting on the other side of the table in terms of the client's whom we were giving advice. But thanks to our giving initiative it meant we'll make an impact to a family on the other side of the world and that made us feel great as advisors, it made our clients feel great as clients and members of this thing and hopefully it makes the world feel a little bit better as well.
Chris Hogan - I noticed that you actually said in one of your lighter updates, I think it was May 15, that unfortunately to date now initiative is only given 10 million days and inspire others to a further 10 million days. Why did you say unfortunately?
Harvee Pene - We love to think big and I've got some big aspirations for what I want to achieve in my life and I'll share what motivated that in a moment. But my big goal my personal mission, that I'm on, Chris, is to give one billion days of life changing help to help end extreme global poverty by 2030 which is in alignment with the UN Global Goals that you mentioned earlier on and so, yeah, 10 million is amazing, but we've got quite a way to go. And that was really the reason for my leaving Inspiring in great hands because I've been really inspired by its mission to hit this target, this impossible target of 1 billion and I just know that that's not gonna be possible from one firm so its really spoken to the next chapter in my journey.
Chris Hogan - And thank you for I think starting that dialogue publicly because, I've also taken on such a massive goal and by 2030, I wanna educate 1 million Australian children on mental health. Now, that number is nothing to your 1 billion but, what it does actually mean, is that it's actually gonna cost me a million dollars. And, for me to say I'm gonna give a million dollars to charity and $2 million to a cause that I'm very passionate about, is mind-boggling. But I do know that it's gonna take me 10 years to do it but in order to do it, using the 1% rule, it's a hundred million dollars between now and 2030. It's basically the, either the money I need to generate, which is for huge tasks but if I don't want my clients that are on board with also being passionate about mental health, then it's highly possible. So, yeah, sometimes it's good to be realistic and say, maybe I can't do this on my own. So, can you tell us about, I just wanna go back a few steps. As I've mentioned to you, may media build brands on purpose. So your purpose was first, I think to help your customers. It wasn't to be just altruistic have big clubs with goals, that came second yeah? And that was a really important point that you made. I think that we all get stuck in, hey, I wanna be altruistic, we wanna save the world. However, I need to focus a little bit more locally first. So, can you just riff on that for a little bit?
Harvee Pene - Love to bro and I think that word local is really important. I actually started the journey in the most local way possible, it started with myself. The very first step was finding my own purpose and how I found that in the most interesting of ways, it was actually on a hospital bed, was three years ago to this day, I was blindsided by cancer, Chris. You may remember and the story goes that I felt a lump in my left nut one day, and I wanted to serve---
Chris Hogan - Sorry, sorry, I don't mean to laugh but when you say that man, I can't help it, sorry.
Harvee Pene - I know, we're talking testicles and nuts and balls, sorry, everybody. I said I would show everything or share everything. You know, 31, felt a little lump where I, as a man, definitely didn't want to feel anything abnormal. And I brushed it off thinking man, now this is just a bit of a rugby accident, it'll go away. And by Friday, I found out that I had cancer, testicular cancer and by the following Monday, a week after I felt the lump, I was in a hospital bed having my left nut removed and the tumour and my whole world sort of falling down upon itself. And that was pretty crazy because you know, when you're 31, you feel like you're invincible, bulletproof, I've got my whole life ahead of me. I literally have 110 year planning because that's how long I plan on living. I've got like, the goals that I wanna achieve all the way throughout that I'm like, I don't have time to die. I'm only like a third of the way through this thing called life. Pre cancer, life was, you know, money, success, fame, business as a platform for doing really well for me. And cancer gave me the ultimate gift. And I might even give part of that gift to everybody now because I remember on that hospital bed, I was lying down, I had to ask myself a question. I'll ask you to think about that yourself and that question was this. If today was the last day of your life, would you be happy with what you're leaving behind? And what's crazy about that question is, it's legacy and we don't really get a chance or a choice as to whether we leave a legacy or not. It's more a decision as to whether we're gonna be proud of the legacy that we're leaving behind. And so, cancer gave me the platform or the mirror to reflect on that very question. And so I gave everything I could to my healing journey, my recovery and to my life to still be here. Because my answer to that decision, I wasn't proud of what I was leaving behind. I had so much more that I wanted to give to myself, my family and to the world. And so I survived because I wanted to keep on creating and building that legacy. And so, I know sometimes like right now we're in the middle of this Coronavirus pandemic and we feel like we're all losing things. We're losing out on money and some of us have lost jobs. Some of us have lost our retirement savings, many of us are losing our social connections and a lifestyle that we're familiar with. And sometimes that can be very overwhelming 'cause we feel like we're losing all of ourselves. But I know from the cancer experience was, as I was losing really important parts of me I actually, the gift was is that I was actually finding the most important parts. And for me, that was my purpose and now I articulate that as to do good and inspire others. And so I'm really grateful, thank you, I'm really grateful to, A;be able to articulate that, because that is a gift to know the answer to why are you here is an amazing gift. And I think that finding a personal purpose in life can simply just be our purpose in life just to go out there and try to find that thing. But I'm so grateful to have found it and to have a second chance to life. To live true to those words, to do good and inspire others. And so that's what's spawns the transformation within business. That's what spurred the giving initiatives and the support of the global goals and that's what's spurring now might move out from inspiring towards the industry as a whole. But sometimes I think we start thinking, Okay, so what is my business purpose? What's our mission statement? Our values? And I think that's the secondary question that needs to come after the first one, which is, why am I here?
Chris Hogan - Right on, right on and I have a story of adversity as well, but we won't get into that today. It is very fascinating to me that how we have to almost go through some kind of adversity sometimes to actually really have this wake up call. And I think that's what, meditating on your death, daily, potentially, can actually mean. It is that actual wake up call. Famous mobility expert, Ido Portal, actually says that it is healthy to meditate on your death daily and to say, is today a good day to die? And, I'll say it now publicly, I was actually in the room doing some work behind that every time I go for a surf and I feel just that little bit of pain in the gut and go, Oh, this is a little bit scary, I say to myself, is today a good day to die and just meditate on am I leaving my family in a good place? Have I actually set a good example? And, every time I say yeah. Look, it might not be the perfect scenario but it's as good as it gets.
Harvee Pene - If you don't mind, can I share practical tip on that.
Chris Hogan - Yeah.
Harvee Pene - There's a really powerful app, I love that idea of he does to meditate on that death daily and it can sound quite morbid. There's a really good app that I have called T-Zero and it's a countdown timer. And I use it to count down the time I have to certain deadlines. In business, in life, we all got deadlines from books, or publishing deadlines or when you've got big meetings or big presentations. And so I put in that key deadlines that I've got. So we've got a baby on our way, which is really exciting.
Chris Hogan - Congratulations mate.
Harvee Pene - Thank you, 96 days, 17 hours, 26 seconds. According to the app, we've got a holiday booked. We're going overseas whether the world's ready for us or not. But that's for next year. And so we've got these ability to kind of see these exciting events coming up in the future and realise and be conscious of how close they're actually are or how far they are at away from us. And I've got one timer in there that I called the ultimate deadline. It's called days to death. And so I mentioned before I plan on living to 110 years old and so I put that in my timer and every day, I did that little mini meditation where I flick through and I'm like cool, babies due in 96 days. We're off to Vietnam in 364 days, oh and I'm gonna die in 76 years 57 like that whole flow on effect. And it's a good little reminder that the ultimate deadlines there and so if we can use the time that we have to inspire before we expire, let's not waste a minute.
Chris Hogan - That's awesome dude. So with regards to the purpose and coming back to that, some people say it's about finding your why, purpose, values, mission, vision, it's all very, we take English very literally but it all centres around the same thing. There's a new belief that we're in the era of who. Who can we impact? And I believe you made that discovery early. Well, right on the cusp of, being an early adopter. So, do you think that was an important thought or catalysts to your purpose that was more about who versus why or do you think that's just all like I said, literal English jargon?
Harvee Pene - Yeah, that's a very interesting one. I think what helped me settle on the do good and inspire others was a reconciliation of the life that I had lived until that point on that hospital bed and mapping out what is the things that I loved, versus what are the things that I hate. What things gave me energy versus what drained my energy. what lit my fire up versus the things that took it away. And it gave me resonant themes of the people I love to serve and the people I love to make an impact on. And so I think in my case, it may have been more who driven, but that could be being a people person. But I started drawing sort of visual circles around myself and my family and my future children, like we've got three now and I'd love seven in total so I thought about the impact that I can make on them.
Chris Hogan - All with one nut dude.
Harvee Pene - You can still fire play with one propeller. And then you had these eccentric circles building out to, your immediate family or extended family or friends and then in business, we've got this beautiful vehicle to be able to make an impact on our team members. And the clients who interact with us and the local communities that we serve. And then if we kind of extend out to bigger realm what we eventually get, well, I tapped into this idea that one day, I might be able to make an impact on people that I'll never even get to meet. So, in my case, it became really real by focusing on who and that gave me the clarity on the why, that I needed to do this. And it was that personal clarity that was like the falling domino that made the business mission or the business purpose really clear as well. But for me, it had to happen in that order as we never had a really powerful mission in our business until I had a really powerful mission in my life.
Chris Hogan - Right, so let's talk about quickly the journey and I expect well, that it wasn't just a simple J curve, from when you actually adopted your purpose in business. And where did it start? It would have started with obviously the thought and the process behind what is your purpose, your business purpose now that you discovered your personal purpose. And, what were those all those steps like? What were those things that you did along the way, that you think that every human, ordinary human can do?
Harvee Pene - We could always set out to make an impact in business. That's why we did things differently and that's why we started and it's why we left our previous roles and other accounting firms because they felt like cogs in the machine. And so impact was always really central. It was a common word and common theme that kept on popping up. But I knew I love words, and I love the power of communication and the power of emotive words to really move people to action. And so I had thought of this word impact and I thought, how can we turn that into something that would rally action, that would move me, that would move my team and move the people that would come across us to want to, take some form of action, whether it's come on board as a client and engage on, implement on the advice that we had to share or whether it would be to tell someone else about the mission that we were on. And so, I had one key word, which was impact. And so I challenge everyone to thinking about what were, what are and where the key words that come to mind when I ask you the question, why did you even get into business in the first place? Now, what was the purpose before things got noisy and busy and complex, what was your main motivating reason for getting into this thing in the first place? And, when I took the time to really reflect on that, that the word was impact? And so, that really gave the clarity that we were actually on a mission to become Australia's most impactful accounting firm. And that's a big bold statement, but it forced us, just like your million dollars commitment and your million people of impact commitment, forces you to become a different person. That type of person that has to grow into the type of person that could pull off something like that. And that's what I love about big, hairy, audacious goals. And sometimes they can be impossible and you might never achieve them but that's not the point. It's about who you become on that journey to getting to that point. Going on a mission to become Australia's most impactful accounting firm was one of those impossible missions or mission impossible. And that shouldn't be a scary thought for everyone. In a sense, one billion days of life changing help is a mission impossible, as well but I'm looking forward to the type of person that I need to become in order to pull off these types of goals. So yeah, one word, impact, my question to everyone listening is, what is your one word?
Chris Hogan - Fantastic. So, just to go back to my original question, I really appreciated your answers, it was great insight. What I'm digging for, is those steps along the way and how many of those ideas, started, succeeded, failed, so on and so forth. So, first of all, he said, let's start a cafe. How long did that last? How long did you let that last and then turn that idea off? And then start on the next idea?
Harvee Pene - Yeah, so we were two years into the cafe and then when I bought into Inspire, sorry, the cafe existed for two years before I sort of showed up on the scene. And when I bought into Inspire, my sort of first port of call was to shut it down. And, it wasn't just draining out our finances that time, but it was draining out available focus because we were busy making coffees when we should have been busy making an impact. And so that was the first stage. The very next idea that we had and we launched with, and I did this very, very quickly after the cafe closed, was our first ever impact campaign. And that was called Save 500,000 Tax. You gotta remember at the time, Chris, there was me and my business partner, Ben. And I think his sister was working part time through a small, small firm, arguably nobodies. And I said to my business partner one day, "Hey, Benny, "I think we've got to go big and get ourselves out there "in a new way. "If I were to say publicly that we're gonna aim to hit "a target of tax savings in the next 12 weeks before the end "of financial year, what number would make "you poop yourself?" And he's like, "Okay, maybe half a million." I'm like, "Beautiful, I'll see you in a bit." And so that afternoon went public on Facebook and said we're launching the Save 500,000 Tax Campaign and it's a bold hair, audacious goals for Inspire to proactively help our clients save $500,000 tax in the next 12 weeks, through giving proactive advice and helping people make smart financial decisions before the end of the financial year. And we didn't think, we honestly didn't think. It was mission impossible. We thought, by our own calculations, we might hit 100, $200,000 in tax savings, but we blew our own expectations in 12 weeks, we ended up saving our clients $1.26 million, which was an incredible fete. I think the lesson there is, sometimes you can shoot for the moon and they say even if you fall, you'll land amongst the stars. But every now and then when you shoot for the moon, you might actually hit all the way and further. So that was our experience and that was our first taste of living true to this word of impact. But it actually helped us, what's the word? We really tripped over or helped us find that in order to become Australia's most impactful accounting firm, we needed to start measuring it. And so we never measured our tax savings and no accounting firm ever did ever in the whole wide world before that campaign. And so it gave us credibility, it gave us a goal, gave us a challenge and a mission and now it gave us credibility because we set a goal that was impossible, we didn't just get it, we went well beyond. And it was that first campaign that led to our next campaign, which led to our next, to our next, to our next, which now, shows up as the Day for Dollar giving initiative, but it took a couple of goes on the journey to kind of get to that to this point today.
Chris Hogan - Right, great, man. There was a book in there too. When did that sort of come in, that asset development?
Harvee Pene - Yeah, so we did the Save 500,000 Tax campaign. After that, we did another campaign called Give 1 million Days, which is our first giving initiative, where we set out to save our clients a million dollars in tax and give a day of access to water for every dollar of tax that we saved. That flowed and then after that, we decided to sort of formulate the ideas that we had learned from working with thousands of businesses through these campaigns, into a book because we knew we wanted to make more impact. But at the same time, we knew we only had so many hours in the day and so many people we could have employed. So, that was the birth of the book called "Cashed Up: 7 Steps to Pull More Money and Time and Happiness from Your Business". And it was intended to help our clients make smarter financial decisions and it showcased all the smart financial decisions that we'd be making, helping our clients make and we ourselves had made in our own businesses.
Chris Hogan - Awesome. And when did I guess the speakers sort of stuff come into play? Or was there any other trip ups that happened along that way that or ideas that went, not so good? Or you were just on a roll. I think you're one of the things that given the amount of time that you've done this in, potentially, you were on a roll and had very few trip ups. And sometimes that happens when you just discover something and you just consistently showing up, that's what happened. What's gonna happen next?
Harvee Pene - Yeah, I wouldn't say we had any, like really powerful trip ups or failures. I would just say that we very consistently aimed for well beyond what we had the capacity to achieve. And so we failed in the sense that we never really nailed the fullest vision. But that's okay, when the goal is so big and you only land halfway and it's still miles ahead of where you thought you could have been yourself then that's fine. So it was in that sense we failed repeatedly because of the size and scope of that vision. But it was it was a matter of being on a roll because, Save 500,000 Tax, the first campaign helped us realise actually we need to start measuring out our tax savings because this probably would be one of the key measures of our success. The next campaign Give 1 million Days, was the first time we ever started to link that impact to giving which was at our hearts and so we sort of built on that success. And then the next campaign that came after that was, A Day For Dollar Initiative and so, you might look at Day For Dollar now and go, well that is beautiful and that's a really masterful execution of a giving initiative but it took a few goes and starting small to really get to that point where we are today. And I think, quite often in business we're all looking and comparing ourselves to others who are out there. And we're looking at their chapter 10 and we're at our chapter one, and we go, oh my gosh, we're so far. "We're so far behind." But really, we're all paying our own price. And it was actually from watching other people's chapter 10s that we got a lot of inspiration. So, it was the team at, "Thank you". I've got their bottles right here who had inspired us, in a business sense hugely around how they could use their business or our business as a force for good. But they are the ones who kicked off the campaign. They had a famous campaign, as you may know, chapter one where they launched, "Book of all things". And it was a famously done campaign where you could pay what you want for the book and it was impossible target that they blew away and they raised $1.2 million by selling a book, come on. But what we realised so that it wasn't, what would you pay for the, for a book that has so many pages? It's how much do you want to support this idea that could go forward to change the world. And that's the opportunity that we've all got, when we're a business on purpose.
Chris Hogan - Unbelievable, it is actually unbelievable, I mean, for a lot of people that are just starting the grassroots notion that, to build a business on purpose and brand on purpose and then to have success off the back of that. There's very few people that actually have believed it and then done it and now the science in the actual case studies are coming out. So, it's truly amazing. Now, yes it was May 15, that you publicly announced that your new goal, post retirement, so you're back in the thick of things already, is to save $100,000 in businesses from the economic crisis. Can you tell us a bit about that?
Harvee Pene - Yeah, so you're starting to get a theme with these missions that are impossible, they're measurable but they're really challenging and calls to action. And so, I left Inspire so that I could pursue this impossible goal of 1 billion days of life changing help and I knew the only way to pull that off would be to look at the accounting industry as a whole. And I truly believe that accountants change lives. And so what if I could unite the world's most impactful accounting firms and encourage them to work together to create and build a better world. And that's the vision of what I see with my ability to make the world a better place. To influence, life changing accountants all over the planet. To do some good. And so, seeing the times that we're living in, where Coronavirus, has really kind of blindsided the world at the moment, in a financial sense, there's a war going on. And in many ways accountants are or could be or should be the financial front line. And, the only difference for many businesses between life and death, maybe smart financial decisions and who better to guide business owners through this war and out the other side to use this time as a reset for the better than their accountants. And so the campaign is a rallying call to accountants to, there's 10,000 accounting firms in Australia, 1.2 million I believe in the world. It's massive, yet there the feeling amongst candidates is that we're all in competition with each other. And so as a result, when you see other accounting firms as competitors, everyone tends to play their cards close to their chest and don't share what's working for them. And as a result, we get this very competitive nature. And only one can win. Whereas the new world that I believe that we're in is, as we get a move from the wisdom of ones to the wisdom of million. You may have heard of this quote, that a rising tide raises all ships. So if we could use this once in a lifetime opportunity, that is the world that we're in right now, to come together as accountants or if you're listening to this and you're not an accountant but you have one, let them know about the campaign because the world needs us as accountants more than ever before. And so yeah, the big, hairy, audacious goal, let's save 100,000 businesses from the economic fallout that is happening globally. And our weapon is smart financial decisions. And so let's go out there and help our clients make it and let's save them and let's help them build a business that exists as a force for good.
Chris Hogan - Fantastic, and you back to local again, which is, it's just awesome. It speaks to my heart. I've always thought it is important to be a global local, think globally act locally. So, where do people go? Where do people go to sign up for that and get better educated?
Harvee Pene - If you're in business, you'd be able to get a copy of the book "Cashed Up". If you're an accountant, you'll be able to get a copy of the book, "Become a life changing accountant". And either way, what you'll notice, Chris, is the thing that we've got an opportunity in business to use our businesses as a force for good. So anything I can do to help people out there realise the power that we have to change lives then I'm at your humble service.
Chris Hogan - Fantastic and is there an accounting website as well?
Harvee Pene - Yeah you'll be able to go to inspirebusiness.com
Chris Hogan - Okay, and what about the accountants for good.
Harvee Pene - You'll be able to go to accountantsforgood.com
Chris Hogan - Okay, very good. Thanks very much.
Harvee Pene - And there's the URL list.
Chris Hogan - How do people stay across what you're doing? what's the best channels to get up to the minute updates on your life and your journey?
Harvee Pene - It's not that interesting I believe but it was so funny hearing you say so many times "On May 8th you said this, on May 15th, you said that". Wow, it'll watch out what I say. In general I'm 34, I'm all over the socials so have your penny on Facebook and Instagram, you'll be able to get some real time insights into, just one guy who was lucky enough to find his purpose early. There's using every minute that he has left to live for that mantra to inspire before he expires.
Chris Hogan - Excellent. How much time you got left before your death, mate.
Harvee Pene - I don't know, what do we got. 78 years, 11 months, 15 hours and 37, 36, 35--
Chris Hogan - Excellent.
Harvee Pene - 34 seconds.
Chris Hogan - You better get cracking. Thank you so much for your time Harvee.